Someone in the chat room was told that once a person has a diagnosis, you cannot sign legal documents. I don't know if they meant a dx of Alzheimer's, or of just dementia. In my non-legal opinion, I would think that an adult always has the right of signing documents until a court has taken away that right and given guardianship or conservatorship to another person. I realize that in the latter stages the person's capacity is obvious to the lay person, but I'm talking in the earlier stages.

I had a bad experience on jury duty. I was chosen for a panel. The attorney asked if anyone had a reason not to be able to participate fully. I was embarrassed to say I had memory problems, so I said nothing. Fortunately others were chosen, I was excused. I don't want to be in charge of another person's legal fate at this time.

What has been everyone's experience as far as signing legal documents once they have been diagnosed?

Iris L.

Iris---Please exercise due diligence before signing on the dotted line. I don't have a lick of legal training...but...believe that a diagnosis of A/D is not equal to a declatation of incompetence. If it were...there would be no reason for caregivers to urge their loved ones to execute wills, living wills, etc before they suffer major comprehension losses.

Charlie was considered competent enough to sign an informed consent form when he applied to clinical trials. (He understood them). He uses his charge cards to make purchases...signed up for Direct TV...Car dealers try to sell him cars.

Iris,
I'm not sure about what you are asking (legally). I still charge things and pay my bills on line. I have executed POA's, DPOA's and MPoa's for the future.

Like you, I have chosen to no longer participate in jury duty because I don't feel like a could follow a trial and remember everything to make a good decision.

Wow, life changes by the minute!

Iris, simply being diagnosed doesn't take away any of your legal rights in Colorado. I think I've read that some states require the diagnosing doctor to inform the State's driving department . . . I think, not sure.

As for serving on a jury, I believe we are compelled to disclose our diagnosis. I believe that any judge would see that as a material fact that would disqualify us from serving. I would go so far as to speculate that if one were to silently serve on a jury, and it would later be revealed that we had a dementia diagnosis, that would be grounds for a mistrial.

I welcome other views.

Please let me clarify since I muddied up the waters with the jury duty story. Person A was told by Person B that she could no longer sign legal documents once she had a diagnosis of dementia. I told Person A, No, I did not believe that was so, because I believe only a judge can say someone is imcompetent. I want to know what has been people's experience with signing legal documents after getting a diagnosis of dementia?

I hope this is less confusing.

Iris L.

Iris, my getting confused and off-track doesn't necessarily mean you didn't express yourself clearly.

Regarding driving,

California does have a responsibility of the doctor to notify the DMV. I sought the help of a specialist in California and she told me not to be assessed by her as she would most likely have to report me to DMV.

Idaho has a code section that criminalizes inattentive driving. This can mean talking on the cell phone and causing an accident to being unable to maintain attention.

Tuesday, my Occupational Therapist wants to go driving with me. She is also the local driving assessment person. Her goal is to get me back in the drivers seat, not to disqualify me.

POA's can be executed in advance to take effect upon the doctor's or some other professional's determination. There is not an automatic "incompetence" procedure. That is why there are psych hold procedures in place.

This would not mean that a signature could not be challenged by family or others as happening after a person became incompetent.

Just to jump in with a comment on the jury duty question: When the judge asks if anyone has a medical reason they cannot serve, the person with a problem is allowed to disclose that one-on-one with the judge. It could be that you have a tendency to blood clots and the doctor has ordered you not to sit still for extended times, or you have bladder control issues, or you have a seizure disorder that is not well controlled or any number of other problems. No one will have ever have grounds to speculate what your problem is.

If the judge expects you to speak your reason in open court, politely ask, "Your honor, may I approach?" or "May I speak to you in private, your honor?" This request will invariably be granted.

Thank you Carolina Songbird for your answer regarding the jury duty question.

My concern is that there may be some symptomatic people who avoid getting a diagnosis, thinking it will mean automatic incompetence. We're always talking about early diagnosis and early treatment. This false belief will only serve to delay whatever help the patient and family need.

Iris L.

Re your original question: a diagnosis does not mean the person is legally incompetent. That is an entirely different issue. I know that here in CA (and I'm sure it's the same way in most/all states), even if the court appoints a guardian or conservator for a dementia patient, the patient may still retain many legal rights, including the right to sign certain legal documents.

The courts do *not* want to take away any more of a person's rights than is absolutely necessary.

Re jury duty: when you receive a summons, there will usually be a form on it (e.g., on the back) that you can use to fill out and mail in a request to be excused. You shouldn't even have to show up at court.

Thank you JAB for the information. I'll bring this back to the chat room.

Iris L.

Hi Iris

I had absolutely no problems signing legal documents. But, I have also drawn up legal papers assigning my brother with power of atty.

I tried this with my husband. He was trying to sell everything I owned (2nd marriage) and was telling people while I was sitting there, that I was going to die within 3 years....

My brother is with me when I go through any legal document. In addition to medical papers. I have difficulty understanding what I'm reading. If there's more than one directive in a sentence, then I'm lost!

I don't know if you also have a person that you trust for such personal areas that comes up within one's life. But, it was the best thing that I have ever done!

My brother and I have a special bond. I trust him with my life!

Please, in the future, don't be ashamed of your disease. You certainly didn't ask for it! You'd be surprised how many people are "shocked" that there is such thing as E.O.A.D.! It's astounding.

M

Dear Mary, I don't like to say anything about my memory loss in public because until very recently, the medical professionals discounted and mocked me. In fact, one internist said, and I quote: "If it's Alzheimer's, there's nothing you can do about it anyway, so don't worry about it." How would you like him for a doctor?

As far as others, announcing that I have a memory problem is just like announcing to the world, "I'm vulnerable!" You yourself know from your experience with your ex-husband, he saw what he thought was an opportunity and he took it. He never expected that you could see through him or that you could try to stop him. Fortunately, you do have your brother and other family to protect you. That's not my situation. I am surrounded by sharks who are searching for a drop of blood (vulnerablity) for them to pounce. I'm already overwhelmed by financial and legal issues that I can't handle by myself.

As far as the public goes I tell them I have a complicated case of lupus and leave it at that.

Iris L.

Mary, I envy having a brother like yours. I have one remaining sib, an older brother, and he's as trustworthy and useful as . . . oh my, I can't think of a non-vulgar thing. And I won't curse, so, use your imagination.

Iris, two years ago I got to hear a neurologist tell me, "You can't have dementia, all those guys are drooling." A neurologist!! I recommended some books for him to read, and said goodbye.

"I am surrounded by sharks who are searching for a drop of blood (vulnerablity) for them to pounce. I'm already overwhelmed by financial and legal issues that I can't handle by myself."

You need legal representation, I gather, to fight these sharks? I wonder if your state's Alzheimer's Association and other dementia charities have a list of attorneys that want to do a good deed?

Hi Iris

I strongly agree with Alan. Check with the Alz Org to get a list of legal representation. You can also check with your banking company to have your financial bills paid thru them. This way it will free you up and possibly take off the burden!

And yes, I am extremely fortunate. My brother has been extremely caring and helpful towards me. What makes it unique? We weren't raised together! So, we're making up for lost time!

Good luck to you
M

I still sign legal documents when I need to.....

Thank you for bringing this up. I was wondering if I needed to get my Will finished before my diagnosis.

(Oh, and I had a neuro say that because I saw problems in myself, I couldn't possibly have dementia. Only the people whose family brought them in had it! Can you believe the nerve?)

Sue, I totally believe what the neuro said!! I've heard some amazingly dumb things, too. I had a neurologist tell me he knew I didn't have Alzheimer's, because all his Alzheimer's patients were drooling.

We assume that all doctors are competent to treat us. If only that were so! My work kept me around doctors most of my adult life, mainly psychiatrists and emergency department doctors. There are your basic doctors, and there are those doctors that the other doctors go to see. And there are the bottom of the class doctors, who had to cheat their way that far.

And I've been told from diverse professionals that about half of AD patients are incapable of self-awareness, of comprehending that they have any problems.

day before yesterday, mom and i had an interesting situation with trying to cash a check my brother had signed on moms account. the situation was awful. mom has communication skill loss. reading writing speaking. she stands tall nest to me tho.

anyway, they suggested mom sign a withdraw since there was no hold on her accounts. it was afternoon so it took five or six slips to get both names, though misspelled, on the x line. they gave us the cash we requested. i was surprised but grateful that my brother with dpoa does not have a death grip on her money. at least no the one he thot he had. she should have a debit card for emergencies.

we live in oregon, where the hospital repeatedly released her to me, the state investigated, found excellent care and the police would not let him take her from her home, with us, even with dpoa. knowing mom has legal access to her money is a great releif. hope this helps.

ElequentSolution

This is fantastic news! I put my daughter on my checking account. Once my divorce is final, my brother and sis n law will be on my account. To date, I use a debit card only! I can no longer count money. I then, have my sis n law go online (for checking account) to verify my purchases have "hit" and that my daughter is continuing to pay my bills (online). So far, So good!

I'm soo very happy for your family, in that, your mom stays home with you and not your brother! There is definitely love in your home!
Now, get ready for the long haul.....I hope she has a will and power of atty in order. It will make certain areas soo much easier later down the road. That's one less burden I think about!

You've a big heart, take care of yourself too, you'll not be any good to your mom if you don't!
M