There's a young lady who comes to visit her grandmother at the NH. Sometimes she goes into the rooms of residents and talks to them.

For those that are mentally OK -- I don't think there is anything wrong with that and they probably enjoy her company.

For those who are more mentally impaired, it seems to be inappropriate for her to be entering their rooms to "chat."

I don't think she's stealing anything, etc. but it seems to me that it crosses some boundaries.

These are NOT people she knew before. It's one thing to talk to them in the halls, or if she saw a clear sign of some distress, but it seems inappropriate to go into their rooms to strike up a conversation.

I think that the only one who will think this inappropriate is you......It is so nice that this girl talks to lonely forgotten people. If I am ever in their shoes I just hope someone like this comes into my room and engages me in conversation. To show that I am not alone. That to someone I am a living soul.

Phyllis and Roger

quote:

Originally posted by Roger G. care partner:
I think that the only one who will think this inappropriate is you......It is so nice that this girl talks to lonely forgotten people. If I am ever in their shoes I just hope someone like this comes into my room and engages me in conversation. To show that I am not alone. That to someone I am a living soul.

Phyllis and Roger

Well actually my sister thinks it's inappropriate to go into the room to talk to ANY of the residents.

I view the room as a private space...and some of these people aren't capable of "inviting" you in.

I don't know how young this "young lady" is, but my mom adores the young people that come to say hi to her. And I visit several people at the NH Mom is in when I'm there. For some of them, that may be the only outside contact they have during the day. Of course, I only go into the rooms of folks I have met previously in the common areas.

I tend to agree with Roger. But if it makes you uncomfortable for them, you might check with the NH to see if it violates any privacy policy.

This could become a good thread. I have a friend that agrees with you. So, in the end, I could be wrong.........or many more will agree with you than me.

But, it is a good topic. And I am sure something that happens all the time. Curious to see how this plays out.

Phyllis and Roger

As long as she doesn't seem to be upsetting any of the residents, I kinda think it's nice. So many NH residents don't get visitors often. Hopefully, if the residents get upset or uncomfortable with her visits, she's smart enough to skip visiting with them in the future.

I also didn't mention that I've heard what sound like nosy questions. These are people I've never seen her talk to in the dining room. We're all there virtually every night. This is not a chance encounter.

I'm sure if I went into her grandmother's room...there'd by hell to pay from her mother.

I'm just curious why the staff wouldn't project the privacy of those who can't protect themselves.

I can understand what you're saying as I probably wouldn't have wanted to find a stranger in my mom's room.
When I used to visit my mom in the Alz facility, I would visit and talk to other residents. Most of the times I would see them either in the TV room, dining room or in the hallways.
There were also times when other residents would come in my mom's room to visit or if I sat in the hallway with my mom, some of the residents preferred sitting with me than to go in the TV room.
I know many of the residents had no one and that was so sad to see. I always tried talking to them by saying their name and giving them a hug.

quote:

Originally posted by Always Learning More:
I also didn't mention that I've heard what sound like nosy questions. These are people I've never seen her talk to in the dining room. We're all there virtually every night. This is not a chance encounter.

I'm sure if I went into her grandmother's room...there'd by hell to pay from her mother.

I'm just curious why the staff wouldn't project the privacy of those who can't protect themselves.

I think that loneliness is a bigger problem for the residents in the NH than privacy.
Unless she's asking them for the social security or bank account numbers, I think that even her "nosy" questions are better than the isolation and loneliness so many people there experience. If I had a LO in a facility, I'd be happy if someone talked to them- either in a common area or in their room. If I were you, I definitely wouldn't say anything to the NH staff that might end these friendly visits that the residents are currently getting from this woman's Granddaughter.

It sounds to me as if this young lady is kind hearted and has some compassionate depth to her soul.

Also,,,it could be that since she frequently visits with her Grandmother,,,she has also gotten to know some of the other residents.

And just what "boundaries" do you feel are being crossed?

To tell you the truth,,,when I'm with my Mom,,I also go around and speak with the other residents,,course I don't wake any of them,,and also have a good rapport with the staff too.

But since this seems to "bother you",,,just express your objection to this young lady,,only in regards with her trying to come in and say hi to your Mom.

Mercy me!!!! I never felt as if I were intruding when I went into a resident's room to chat and I really do not believe they felt that either. There were so many people who never had another person to pass a few minutes of caring with them.

They were always so happy to have me there with a smile and a few words with them. They often called out to me to come in when I passed their doors. Most of them remembered a friendly face.

Of course, I would never wake anyone nor intrude if they had visitors.

Do you realize how many residents never have even one family member or friend to visit them?
They are so lonely and really need a little compassion to help pass the time. I still go back to visit some of them.

People need people and to feel worth something.

Nancy B.

Very interesting topic. I always speak to, and sometimes hug, the other residents in the memory unit where Mom lives. And I visit with their families when they are there. It helps to have some connection with everyone. But I don't go in the other resident's rooms. If they are standing where I can see them from the hall, I might stand at the door and talk, but I don't go in. It just doesn't feel right to me to do that. Now, that being said, none of these folks are bed-bound. That might change things somewhat.

I don't feel this is inappropriate personally. Like Roger said, there are a lot of lonely people there and I speak from my own experiences with the residents at my mother's NH. They love that I say hello to them and take time to see how they are. In fact a lot of them stop me to ask for help because they have gotten to know me and trust me. I love to see their faces light up when I see them. So many don't have anyone to see them and as long as she is bringing them some joy, which it sounds like she does. Let her do it. It is such a rewarding thing to do and I'm sure it makes her feel good about herself.

When I was a kid, my dad worked at a NH. I spent a lot of time there. I was about 12 as I recall. I used to visit with folks all the time, and as I recall, I learned right quick who appreciated visitors and who did not. Normally, if the door to the room was open I would just knock and say hello, sometimes talk. Sometimes talk a LOT. I liked old folks. My older son does, too, and enjoys his interactions at the NH where he's employed.

quote:

Originally posted by Puglove:
And just what "boundaries" do you feel are being crossed?

Talking to a resident who is laying flat on his back in his room - and has been for months -- who I never saw her talked to in the dining room. I'm there every night for dinner...we all arrive and leave at approximately the same time.

Some residents have a lot of nice personal belongings, and I would imagine their families might be taken aback by a stranger in their room if they came to visit. (No, I don't think she's taking them.) Some of these people aren't capable of having a conversation. There are other residents sitting in the halls that could be talked to. There are residents who CAN talk about the weather, sports, news, etc.

quote:

Originally posted by Lammie:
When I was a kid, my dad worked at a NH. I spent a lot of time there. I was about 12 as I recall. I used to visit with folks all the time, and as I recall, I learned right quick who appreciated visitors and who did not. Normally, if the door to the room was open I would just knock and say hello, sometimes talk. Sometimes talk a LOT. I liked old folks. My older son does, too, and enjoys his interactions at the NH where he's employed.

It would see the nursing home should have designated volunteers to talk -- they do have volunteers for bingo -- and families should sign some type of permission to say volunteers can come in. There are all kinds of weird people out there. Remember the post about the homeless son? Would you want him chatting up a storm in your family member's room?

Well, I guess it was a different time, small town where everyone knew everyone. I was visiting half the time with grandmas of my friends at school. My own grandma was there for a while, too.

Yes, I can see where a NH might want to do a background check on volunteers, just to make sure they hadn't done anything heinous. I know several residents at my dad's NH, but I don't go into the rooms. I see them outside, the dining hall, stuff like that. I haven't felt compelled to go into another's room.

At the nursing home where I worked (quite a few years ago) we encouraged visitors to talk to anyone they wanted to in the halls or the common rooms but never in the residents rooms. Anyone who entered those rooms was either family or had had a police background check and was a registered volunteer for the home.
I would just check with the staff to see if they have encountered any problems with her. Perhaps she is just a friendly person but we have all heard enough of the exploitation of our seniors to be overly cautious.

I have met a few folks who were okay otherwise, but had a hard time with boundaries. She probably thinks she's doing the right thing, but she probably should not be in people's rooms. We have a sub teacher where I work and she used to like to just walk into the Sp. Ed. classrooms and visit. We'd be doing lessons and stuff and there she'd be. I talked to the vice princ. about it and the visits stopped. After all, she would not walk into an algebra class, why just walk into special ed?

I see 2 sides to the story here. Many of these residents have NO FAMILY to visit and would love to have a nice sweet girl chat with them.

On other hand, after mom's valuable ring was taken (if that's true) out of her room, I'd tend to not want many "unknown" visitors.

There are lots of sleezy people who look the part of "honest" people, and take advantage of our loving parents.

Keep our eyes and ears open.... remember we're their advocates!

People are lonely, even those who don't seem "mentally with it." Even people with regular visitors have lots of down time between contact. I have a feeling that this woman (and the staff) would be able to tell if her visit were causing agitation and she would leave. My sense is that she is a good-hearted person and that her gift is to see the person as they were. Bless her.

how are the residents responding to her??...the ones that can talk?? Do you see a smile on their faces???...I would find out more about her also for my own peace of mind but having said that I know that I never see any other family or friends on my dads floor...they all "know" me...i try to stop and give all of them a hello and a pat on the shoulder..they desperately need the human touch...

Also, my dad's NH has a policy that is posted everywhere..."Knock on the patients door...Announce your name..see if you are permitted to enter...

I will be curious to see what you find out about her...if she were a regular volunteer she would be wearing a badge around her neck that says so...thats been my experience and dad has been in 3 NH.

kim

Always Learning More,
You said a few times that you don't think she's stealing from the people. She's obviously not causing any harm or doing anything illegal.
Whether or not the residents can converse about sports or the weather, I would be willing to bet that most of them are happy to have anyone to give them some friendly attention. She's not the homeless son that was mentioned in another thread. Why not just assume that she's a good person giving a little bit of attention to people who have no one to care about them?

I can see being concerned. Why don't you ask the nursing staff about her? See what take they have on her visiting. It may help to fill in some blanks for you.

quote:

Originally posted by bledsoe:


Also, my dad's NH has a policy that is posted everywhere..."Knock on the patients door...Announce your name..see if you are permitted to enter...

I will be curious to see what you find out about her...if she were a regular volunteer she would be wearing a badge around her neck that says so...thats been my experience and dad has been in 3 NH.

kim

I think that sounds like a good policy/sign. I know her, she's not a volunteer. I would be upset to find her in my mother's room in the state my mother is in right now.

quote:

Originally posted by jellybeans:

Whether or not the residents can converse about sports or the weather, I would be willing to bet that most of them are happy to have anyone to give them some friendly attention. She's not the homeless son that was mentioned in another thread. Why not just assume that she's a good person giving a little bit of attention to people who have no one to care about them?

I don't want her in my mom's room.

And whether she's homeless or filthy rich, the rules should be the same. Respect private areas. Don't put yourself into someone's private space when they are not of sound mind and able to really give you permission to enter the room to visit.

quote:

Originally posted by Ed's59wife:



Do you realize how many residents never have even one family member or friend to visit them?
They are so lonely and really need a little compassion to help pass the time. I still go back to visit some of them.



Nancy B.

Unless you have asked the staff,you really don't know if they have company or not. The administrators don't seem to care because one of the ladies said she wished someone would take them outside once in awhile and have events for those of sound mind.

I go to dinner every night. Other residents have guests every day at lunchtime. Our paths do not cross. So to assume "no visitors" may be totally inaccurate. Last week, I went at a different time and one man (visitor) said he had never seen me before. Yes, he had, but there was no reason to make a big deal of it.

I also saw another resident's son for the first time recently -- after 1 year of seeing her. But that doesn't mean she isn't there every week end, etc. when I am not there.

quote:

Originally posted by Always Learning More:

quote:

Originally posted by jellybeans:

Whether or not the residents can converse about sports or the weather, I would be willing to bet that most of them are happy to have anyone to give them some friendly attention. She's not the homeless son that was mentioned in another thread. Why not just assume that she's a good person giving a little bit of attention to people who have no one to care about them?

I don't want her in my mom's room.

How about telling her that privately and nicely then?
Your Mom is fortunate to have you visit her often. Others there probably aren't so lucky and may really enjoy her company.

I agree with Lammie-- express your concerns about this person to the program director or the head nurse... Just to make sure they know who she is..
There's always a small possibility that something's fishy but I think it's a teeny teeny one (they have no money to give--or shouldn't-- and shouldn't have good jewelry, etc...) and that more likely she's trying to spread joy or that talking to them is helping her to accept her grandmother's disease.

I think privacy is an odd value to promote for someone with mid-stage alzheimer's or beyond.

Why is privacy for her so important to you? This is a real question... I'd like to understand your perspective ...

An unknown young woman visiting them may seem as or MORE familiar to them than would a family member ... Since they often think they're in their twenties, I suspect they would think they know her..and would enjoy her company...

To me every kindness, every visitor is a plus for my mother. Of course you don't have to agree,but I would like to understand..

Always Learning,

If you don't want her in your Mom's room, just tell her and tell the staff. Tell her she's not one of the lonely ones that have no visitors.

I for one have talked to the poor lonely souls at the hospital, but usually only when I hear them calling out for someone and nobody answers. The nurses are more than grateful for someone who can help their patients quiet down and feel loved. What sounds to you like "nosy" questions are probably just the normal questions we are supposed to talk to dementia patients about; things in their past that they may remember, names of children or brothers or sisters, where they used to live, etc.

As someone said above, tell your concerns to the staff just to make sure nothing odd is going on. If they know who she is and they know that she is just visiting out of the kindness of her heart, then be aware that many caregivers would be happy to pay for someone like that to give comfort to their loved ones.

You have every right to tell her not to visit your Mom and if she's the good person I think she is, she will honor your wishes.

Felicia

quote:

Originally posted by brightwings:
etc...)
I think privacy is an odd value to promote for someone with mid-stage alzheimer's or beyond.

Why is privacy for her so important to you? This is a real question... I'd like to understand your perspective ...

..

Many of these people were pretty successful. They have pictures and other mementos on the walls. Perhaps the family would not want someone snooping around -- and didn't think about visitors wandering in. When they moved in, they had the option to opt out of candid photos being taken, that sort of thing.

Maybe the person's health is deteriorating and they need to stay in the room. What extra germs are these guests bringing in? (One of the biggest carriers of germs is TIES on doctors.)

Privacy is a very personal thing. Some people post every move they make on Facebook or Twitter. Others prefer a lower profile. I would think the facility would have some rules in place to protect their own liability.

quote:

Originally posted by Felicia:

What sounds to you like "nosy" questions are probably just the normal questions we are supposed to talk to dementia patients about; things in their past that they may remember, names of children or brothers or sisters, where they used to live, etc.


Felicia

One night she was asking someone, "Why do you keep saying that? What does that mean?" She went into the room after hearing this person say something over and over -- something that is best ignored. I can bet that family would have had a fit if they happened upon her standing there asking the question.

Always--thank you for answering my question. I think I better understand your concern.

Sounds like the girl's heart is bigger than her understanding of this yucky disease... Perhaps the staff could talk to her about why these people are saying such odd things and teach her some ways to respond... (perhaps they could print Understanding the Dementia Experience for her to read or find other appropriate material)...

You just need to be clear with the staff so they can understand your concern and follow your wishes re: your mother...

How old is the young lady? Do you think she sees the NH as if it were a college dorm?

quote:

Originally posted by Always Learning More:

quote:

Originally posted by brightwings:
etc...)
I think privacy is an odd value to promote for someone with mid-stage alzheimer's or beyond.

Why is privacy for her so important to you? This is a real question... I'd like to understand your perspective ...

..

Many of these people were pretty successful. They have pictures and other mementos on the walls. Perhaps the family would not want someone snooping around -- and didn't think about visitors wandering in. When they moved in, they had the option to opt out of candid photos being taken, that sort of thing.

Maybe the person's health is deteriorating and they need to stay in the room. What extra germs are these guests bringing in? (One of the biggest carriers of germs is TIES on doctors.)

Privacy is a very personal thing. Some people post every move they make on Facebook or Twitter. Others prefer a lower profile. I would think the facility would have some rules in place to protect their own liability.

Since you have your LO at this facility, I'm assuming it's a nice facility where the staff is attentive and not some craphole where this woman could go around upsetting residents and none of the staff would care. If this woman were upsetting residents with her visits, I would then assume that being that this is a good facility, that someone from the staff would step in. That doesn't seem to have happened.

If germs are a special concern for particular patients, the facility needs to have signs and equipment available.If these people need to be in isolation or reverse isolation, there would be a sign on the door and a sign about the need to wear personal protective equipment. There's probably a lot of germs in any NH. I really doubt that this woman entering the rooms is going to increase the likelihood of anyone catching anything.

Honestly, if the families are concerned about privacy, they should probably not have anything that should be kept private in the resident's room. The residents are what is important, what makes a resident in a facility happy. This should be the primary concern of the facility.

Again, if you think this woman should not visit your Mom, go ahead and express your feelings to her. But, I think your concerns about this should end there. If you saw someone abusing the residents there, then by all means, I would hope you would speak up, but that is not happening. By stating your opinion to the facility staff, you might end the only visits that some of these residents receive and that would really be a shame.

quote:

Originally posted by jellybeans:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Always Learning More:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by brightwings:
etc...)


Honestly, if the families are concerned about privacy, they should probably not have anything that should be kept private in the resident's room. The residents are what is important, what makes a resident in a facility happy. This should be the primary concern of the facility.

.

Even the nicest places don't pay their nurses aides much money, ie...they are at the lower end of the income scale in many cases.

Regarding privacy -- what about privacy of one's person? If I'm laying in bed in my nightgown, it shouldn't matter how old or sick I am...I don't need strangers coming in or standing at my doorway talking to me.

I notice her family completely shuts the door when they leave the room.

Tonight, an incident occured which I think she was responsible for on behalf of an aide. I am writing a letter to the administrator's and I don't want this aide ever to be assigned to my mother again.

Always,

I think what your finding here is that there is no exact answer to your question. Many of us have expressed that we would love someone to visit with our Loved Ones, others agree with you. I think it is just a matter of opinion. The question the "woman" was asking the patient is one that I have would have asked if a patient was saying something over and over, trying my best to calm her down or understand what they are trying to say. This woman seems very caring to me, yet to you she is invading the privacy of others. Like I said before, just express to her and the administrators that you don't want strangers visiting your Mom.

You sound very very concerned about your Mom, and you are a very good advocate for her. But remember that your Mom is in a very different place now, and her needs and desires may have changed. Watch the faces and reactions from the patients this woman visits, I bet most of them benefit from her visits.

If more patients had caring family members like you, extra visits from strangers wouldn't be needed.

Felicia

I've thought about this, and I have decided that, in this case anyway, this lady is a loonie and should not be rambling around the NH visiting everyone. She'd annoy me, too.

It's one thing to be visiting folks you have kinda come to know through association wtih loved ones, but it's another to be someone just wandering around, with what sounds like little understanding of dementia, maybe causing more harm than good.

quote:

Originally posted by Felicia:
Always,

IThis woman seems very caring to me, yet to you she is invading the privacy of others. Like I said before, just express to her and the administrators that you don't want strangers visiting your Mom.

You sound very very concerned about your Mom, and you are a very good advocate for her. But remember that your Mom is in a very different place now, and her needs and desires may have changed. Watch the faces and reactions from the patients this woman visits, I bet most of them benefit from her visits.


Felicia

The people I'm referring to did NOT benefit from her visit.

I have contacted the facility and they are asking me what should be done. Someone here suggested signs and I think that is a good place to start...then they have conveyed their "policy."

I think something like, "Please respect the privacy of residents in their rooms. Please check with the nurse before entering rooms."

That would put people on alert that maybe what they are doing is not acceptable. This would also cover situations where an old friend dropped by, but perhaps the resident is ill, etc. I have told people NOT to visit mom as the person was somone she hadn't seen -- or communicated with -- in 20 years..and was never a friend of this person.

This bring back memories way, way back. I use to work at a NH, got to know all residences. But I notice there was this gentleman very sad and lonely, never saw anyone visiting him. So I started bringing him roses from my mom's garden once a week. I enjoyed seeing that big smile in his face. He was a very soft spoken person. I did this for over a year when all of a sudden I notice a lady visiting him, he called me in and introduce me to his daughter. She thank me for the roses that his father received every week.(Evidently he told her.) Well I never had to worry about this anymore because she took over and started doing this herself. It made me so happy that maybe I had put an example to this young lady how important her father was.
I saw him alot more happy and that made me feel so good. I also saw her visiting him more often.
God Bless!
Hope

It is very clear to me that you love your mom a lot.

But you sound very angry, and while I understand a measure of concern, I'm not sure the anger is what is called for here. In the NH in our town, there are MANY residents who don't get any visitors, even on holidays. None at all. And their faces just light up when you smile at them, or ask them how they're doing, or hold their hand(s). So many families just can't take the time out from their busy lives to do that for their parent(s). And you know, even when someone is repeating the same thing over and over again, it doesn't mean that they don't benefit from another person's company....I've actually been there....but it does sound like the question was inconsiderate....not everyone understands dementia, though. I know I didn't, before I had no choice.

There is a couple in our town who make a weekly visit to the nursing home and talk with as many residents as they can. They go in to the rooms and read to the residents, chat with them, pray with them... I am sure that they are probably not experts in how to talk with a person with dementia either and maybe they are praying in the room(s) of someone who doesn't believe in that way or whatever (it sounds like this girl could use a little mentoring), but it's the gesture that really matters, the fact that they are trying their best to make a not-very-fun situation a little more bearable.

I also believe in the "catch more flies with honey" approach, and if you approach every situation at the NH (that you do not agree with) in this angry, indignant tone, you may find the staff to be less receptive than you would like. It is important to be viewed by the staff as a staunch advocate, and not a "troublemaker". (I'm not saying you are a troublemaker, but just that if you get angry about conditions frequently, the staff might start to view you in that way).

I think the sign you proposed was a good idea.

Hope, what a lovely thing to do with the flowers. What a blessing you must have been to all of the residents who you cared for.

Meowcats, it's great that your neighbors take the time to visit with people in a NH. I think that's really special that they take the time to do so and I'm sure that they like the granddaughter mentioned in the first post really brighten the days of those they visit. Too bad there aren't more people like them.

I guess the thing that surprises me is how many people on this board think it's OK to just enter rooms to talk.

Or maybe at our NH, the residents are in the halls a lot...so there is not need to enter the private rooms and talk to the lonely people. For example, residents are taken to the dining room an hour or more ahead of dinner, and they are then in the dining room a total of 2 hours. (a good 30 to 45 minutes after they are done eating.)

Then they are rolled into the halls to wait to go to bed. I would think this time in the public areas of the building would allow sufficient time for visiting. That's when I talk to them. I don't find a need to enter the privacy of their rooms. Maybe other NHs isolate residents in their rooms more than this facility, which might explain why some people think it's great to wander in and talk.

For the most part, residents who are in their rooms are resting, or they are sick.

The NH Mom is in sounds similar in style to the one your Mom is in. They have most of the residents up and about during the day.

However, there are a few who are bed bound for whatever reason and many times as I walk by they call out "hello". I always stick my head in and talk for a moment.

I see nothing wrong with that. Not everyone in their rooms are there because they are sick or resting. Some are in their rooms for other reasons and I believe they appreciate the company offered to them. If they need assistance or food or drink, I bring it to the attention of an aide.

Admittedly, I would never just walk in on someone, but there are some in the NH who seem to appreciate the company, even for a brief moment and I have come to care for and about them as well.

quote:

Originally posted by patcor:

However, there are a few who are bed bound for whatever reason and many times as I walk by they call out "hello". I always stick my head in and talk for a moment.

I see nothing wrong with that.

I see nothing wrong with sticking your head in. But going all the way into the room to "talk at" someone is different.

Some residents are begging for help...the kind of help you can't provide. For example, you can't take them home to their parents. If their sentences/requests don't make any sense it's almost cruel to go in the room as if you were going to be able to assist them. It's like teasing them by dangling something in front of them. You might also aggrevate them more if you walk in, say a couple of words, then just leave them hanging there as you can't do anything about their predicement.

Always Learning,

As Meowcats stated above, I am also picking up on a lot of anger or frustration from you. For your own health, try to let go of these thoughts. Is the frustration coming from another issue...possibly the whole issue that your Mom has this terrible disease? I know I went through my anger stage...and still do sometimes. Are you fearful for your Mom? Do you feel guilty that she has to be in a home which is making you overly concerned for her safety? If something happens to your Mom when you're not there, it won't be your fault and you aren't a bad daughter because you can't be there all the time. I'm sure your Mom wouldn't want you to worry so much.

As far as I can tell from your posts 1) the woman in question hasn't done anything to hurt you or your Mom, or anyone else in the staff's opinion 2) you have voiced your concerns to the staff 3) you gave staff a suggestion regarding notes on the doors. I believe you have done everything you need to do. You should now "let it go", but if you can't, then you should talk to the woman yourself or at least try to identify where all these feelings are coming from.

The idea about a sign on the door is a good one, and each patient or family member should be able to decide whether they want it there or not. If it was my Loved One, and I had faith in the staff to watch visitors, I would have an open door policy for visitors, unless my Loved One was actually sick or something.

Moonie

Always Learning,

I just read your most recent post. Why is it OK to ignore someone and just let them keep crying and calling out, but it's not OK for someone to try to ease their pain by talking to them. The nurses have no choice, they have many patients to care for and can't take the time to sit with someone all the time; a visitor can. No, they can't take them home, but they can let them know that someone is listening, and they can offer some comforting words. These patients live in their own world, and there is nothing wrong with entering their world to try to fix problems. There is absolutely nothing wrong with telling them yes, someone will be here later. Many of them have no concept of time, they think no one has seen them in years when they had a visitor that very same day. You have to enter their alternate reality sometimes to make them feel "home". Many of us caregivers have come to the conclusion that "home" means "the way it used to be". My Mom would sometimes tell me she wanted to go home, when she was already home. At first I would try to correct her but that would just upset her. I learned that it was much better to just tell her we would be going home soon. After that, she would seem much happier and was able to move on in the conversation. She also asked about calling her Mom, and I learned to finally say, OK we'll call her later because she's not home right now. I didn't lie to hurt her, I used a "fiblet" to make her happy -- just like when my children asked about Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.

Back to your original question, you have every right to keep visitors out of your Mom's room and you have talked to the staff so your request should be honored. It may not seem appropriate to you, but to me I would hope someone would care enough to try help my Mom if she's calling out. It doesn't matter if they're successful or not, at least they tried.

I feel entering someone's room would be appropriate if it's for the sole purpose of comforting someone in need.

Felicia

ALM,

Ten or so years ago, I used to go play the piano at a nursing home on a weekly basis. Just for background on my following comments.

I think one thing you maybe don't understand at this point is that by the nature of the beast, a NH is indeed much more like a college dormitory than it is an apartment building. With nurses, doctors, aides, family, chaplains, and the like in and out all the time, privacy is essentially nonexistent.

To repeat the advice so many people have already given you here: If your gut tells you something is wrong with this young person (and you haven't defined "young" yet), talk to the NH director. If s/he assures you this person has been fully vetted, you need to either trust the director's words or move your mother to another NH. Because if you cannot trust the NH director, whom can you trust?

I also agree with the posters who've commented that there's an awful lot of anger in your posts, anger that has nothing to do with this young woman. For one thing, she is there for a very legitimate reason: She is visiting her grandmother. See your very first post in this thread.

So she's not some homeless person or con artist who's wandered in off the streets, someone who has no connection to the NH.

Frankly, sometimes a perfect stranger has an easier job of talking to dementia patients than we who have been their caregivers do. Our mothers and fathers with dementia have never told that perfect stranger "I hate you", they have never falsely accused that perfect stranger of stealing, they have never acted like a 5-yo child around that perfect stranger.

It was much, much easier for me to deal with NH patients in my piano-playing days than it is for me to deal with my "I hate you" mother now. No baggage.

Let this young woman do the mitzvah or good deed she is performing. You never know, one day your own mother may benefit from her kind word or smile.

Always
I know you've been having difficulty getting your mother a Medicaid bed in this home.

This may have nothing to do with it BUT I wanted to raise the possibility.

If there's only one bed available, the NH may choose the family that is easiest to deal with or whom they find most helpful.
They may prefer having family members like the grand-daughter who help out, who are present for others besides their LO's.

The aides often only have time to clean poop, wash, dress patients-- and not time to be present with them. (My home aides who have worked in NH's say they were even penalized for being too attentive--since there was so much work to do).

In our responses to you, we're imagining a 'young lady" whose motivations are caring--even if she needs more training in how she best help. (best may be just to hold their hands or sing to them...)
If she's a troubled young person, then some of us might feel differently. But even a troubled young person can help others and be helped herself--if if the staff trains her.

We're not there so we only see and understand what you've described-- and what our imaginations wrongly or rightly fill in. But be aware that many of us feel our LO's have more than enough privacy in NH's.

quote:

Originally posted by brightwings:
Always
I know you've been having difficulty getting your mother a Medicaid bed in this home.

This may have nothing to do with it BUT I wanted to raise the possibility.

If there's only one bed available, the NH may choose the family that is easiest to deal with or whom they find most helpful.
They may prefer having family members like the grand-daughter who help out, who are present for others besides their LO's.

The aides often only have time to clean poop, wash, dress patients-- and not time to be present with them. (My home aides who have worked in NH's say they were even penalized for being too attentive--since there was so much work to do).

In our responses to you, we're imagining a 'young lady" whose motivations are caring--even if she needs more training in how she best help. (best may be just to hold their hands or sing to them...)
If she's a troubled young person, then some of us might feel differently. But even a troubled young person can help others and be helped herself--if if the staff trains her.

We're not there so we only see and understand what you've described-- and what our imaginations wrongly or rightly fill in. But be aware that many of us feel our LO's have more than enough privacy in NH's.

I find it sad that a NH would punish staff for visiting. I can see it being abused by some, but that's surprising. At the NH where my son works, it is a requirement that the staff visit with the residents for as long as the residents want to visit. My son says that they residents don't normally take up an abnormal amount of his time. He's been "adopted" several times and has all kinds of grandmas there.

There was even one black lady who just swore that my blonde haired, blue eyed son was her grandchild. It got to where her family come to visit and wanted to meet my son, a little concerned because they wanted to make sure that he was not trying to exploit her. Once they met my son, they all had a good laugh and they said that they were grateful for the company when the family could not be there.

quote:

Originally posted by Moonie:
Always Learning,

As Meowcats stated above, I am also picking up on a lot of anger or frustration from you. For your own health, try to let go of these thoughts. Is the frustration coming from another issue...possibly the whole issue that your Mom has this terrible disease? I know I went through my anger stage...and still do sometimes. Are you fearful for your Mom? Do you feel guilty that she has to be in a home which is making you overly concerned for her safety? If something happens to your Mom when you're not there, it won't be your fault and you aren't a bad daughter because you can't be there all the time. I'm sure your Mom wouldn't want you to worry so much.

As far as I can tell from your posts 1) the woman in question hasn't done anything to hurt you or your Mom, or anyone else in the staff's opinion 2) you have voiced your concerns to the staff 3) you gave staff a suggestion regarding notes on the doors. I believe you have done everything you need to do. You should now "let it go", but if you can't, then you should talk to the woman yourself or at least try to identify where all these feelings are coming from.

The idea about a sign on the door is a good one, and each patient or family member should be able to decide whether they want it there or not. If it was my Loved One, and I had faith in the staff to watch visitors, I would have an open door policy for visitors, unless my Loved One was actually sick or something.

Moonie

No. I just believe in boundaries.

My sister doesn't think anyone should be in anyone's room at any time. She's way more strict in her thoughts about this. If you knew her, you would think she would be totally at the opposiite end of the spectrum.